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Permit application question under criminal history section

Issues related to the permit application process in CT

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NAmenta
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Permit application question under criminal history section

Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:09 pm

Hey guys, I am finally going to file my paperwork for the permit. I do have a question on the criminal history section under "Have you ever been ARRESTED for any crime in any jurisdiction?" Do I have to list arrests where everything was dropped in court and is not on my record? If you read the application it says:

"You are not required to disclose the existence of any arrest, criminal charge or conviction, the records of which have been erased pursuant to C.G.S. 46b-146, 54-76o, or 54-142a". If you look up 54-142a it talks about charges that were dismissed in court.
http://law.justia.com/codes/connecticut/2005/title54/sec54-142a.html

Its a little confusing because the next question is "Have you ever been CONVICTED under the laws of this state-----"?[/url]



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hayes1966
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Postby hayes1966 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:50 pm

Not unless you were convicted.
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Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:59 pm

Ok thank you. Its kind of pointless that they even have the "Have you ever been arrested" question on there if you are not required to list non convictions. They should just have the question asking to list list convictions.

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Postby punisher » Thu Dec 13, 2012 6:37 pm

NAmenta wrote:Ok thank you. Its kind of pointless that they even have the "Have you ever been arrested" question on there if you are not required to list non convictions. They should just have the question asking to list list convictions.


Agreed.
The only thing that matters is if youve been CONVICTED. If you werent,then no to everything.
I was arrested in 2001 but got a pardon in 2007 so NO to everything.
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Postby nvisn » Thu Dec 13, 2012 8:15 pm

hayes1966 wrote:Not unless you were convicted.


Not so fast John. If you were ARRESTED but not convicted you were still ARRESTED. The PDs have and will use this is a dis-qualifier for lying on your application. We have seen it in the CCDL.
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Postby hayes1966 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:41 pm

If you were arrested and not convicted how can that be used against you? There is nothing on your record! By law it has to be removed.
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Postby nvisn » Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:45 pm

there is a difference between being arrested and not convicted and arrested and having it erased. CTKix can elaborate better than I can here. I'll try to summon him.
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Postby ctkix » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:06 pm

If you were arrested, you indeed need to put it down.

I don't agree with it, but it must be done or else you will be going into a hearing with a strike against you for an improperly filled out application..

It gets worse, they can even used erased records in your BFPE hearing. Thanx to our courts, Rado v. Naugutuck Board of Ed sealed the deal on that one. Completely flies in the face of what the intent of the erasure statutes are about.

I see people get away with a lack of juvenile disclosure.

Let me make this clear: Even if your record was erased via accelerated rehabilitation or similar diversionary program, you still need to disclose.

It gets some members of the board frustrated when you don't. They think you are not being truthful and will draw adverse inference on your credibility.

Jonathan

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Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:16 pm

OK, but they key part of my question was in reference to this part of the application.

"You are not required to disclose the existence of any arrest, criminal charge or conviction, the records of which have been erased pursuant to C.G.S. 46b-146, 54-76o, or 54-142a". If you look up 54-142a it talks about charges that were dismissed in court.

here is 54-142a.
http://law.justia.com/codes/connecticut/2005/title54/sec54-142a.html

The thing is i have been arrested when i was younger. I do have a misdemeanor conviction. I also have an arrest from the past that when it was all said and done it was dismissed it in court. It looks to me like a dismissal does not have to be disclosed under arrests but the language is kind of confusing.[/url]

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Postby nvisn » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:18 pm

NAmenta wrote:OK, but they key part of my question was in reference to this part of the application.

"You are not required to disclose the existence of any arrest, criminal charge or conviction, the records of which have been erased pursuant to C.G.S. 46b-146, 54-76o, or 54-142a". If you look up 54-142a it talks about charges that were dismissed in court.

here is 54-142a.
http://law.justia.com/codes/connecticut/2005/title54/sec54-142a.html

The thing is i have been arrested when i was younger. I do have a misdemeanor conviction. I also have an arrest from the past that when it was all said and done it was dismissed it in court. It looks to me like a dismissal does not have to be disclosed under arrests but the language is kind of confusing.[/url]


not to be a jerk but we both answered that question.
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Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:21 pm

To be honest I was planning to do what a buddy of mine just did in Middletown. He got a copy of his record from the State Police and attached it to the application. It does say attach additional sheets if necessary. I was then planning on checking yes to both questions and writing "please see attached sheet."

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Postby nvisn » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:24 pm

NAmenta wrote:To be honest I was planning to do what a buddy of mine just did in Middletown. He got a copy of his record from the State Police and attached it to the application. It does say attach additional sheets if necessary. I was then planning on checking yes to both questions and writing "please see attached sheet."


+1 like the question or hate it. honesty is the best policy.
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Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:24 pm

I understand and thank you, but what I don't understand why they would basically say you are not required to list arrests where the charges were dismissed, thrown out or nolled.

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Postby ctkix » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:25 pm

Hey, I'm at every hearing. I can tell you how it goes:

"why did you deny"

"he was arrested in 1996"

"was that your basis for your denial"

"yes, that and suitability"

"Without looking at your record, can you testify from memory?"

"yes sir, we have officer so and so with us who was the arresting officer"

"officer so and so.... tell us of the night in question...."

And it goes from there.

Rado v. Naugatuck Board of Ed essentially did away with much of the provisions of erasure statutes.

I don't agree, but there is legal precedent.

If you have ten or twenty grand and want to fight it - GREAT! You'd be doing the 2A community a service. But as far as I know, no challenges as of yet.

Jonathan

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Postby NAmenta » Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:29 pm

If you're at the hearings I'd like to ask you a couple questions. Can I pm you?


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